Old london photos black and white


if my memory serves me correctly,

If you have a question you would like an answer to please get in touch and I will put it on this page.

 

07/06/18

Contract Bus Services

I am still trying to establish the identity of ten AEC half-cabs that David John Jones (Crymych) operated daily from Fishguard Bay Hotel to Milford Haven carrying construction workers to the Esso site 1959/60. I now believe that these possibly belonged to Contract Bus Services and were manned and maintained by David Jones on behalf of CBS. Jones bought three ex Maidstone & District AEC Regals from the batches registered JKM401-461. I think that the contract ones also came from the same list. CBS bought 15 of them from Passenger Vehicle Disposals and a further 13 from Fleet Car Sales of Dunchurch. Of these 28 a large number found their way to a variety of operators, dealers and dismantlers in south Wales during the period immediately after their work in west Wales would have finished. My question is; Do any OBP contributors have any details of the the contracts taken on by Contract Bus Services in that time frame, say late 1958 to late 1960? Also would I be correct in saying that CBS operated in all-over green livery?

Les Dickinson

09/05/18

County Travel

Bit of a long shot but would anyone have a fleet list for County Travel please, if so could I possibly have a copy.

Adrian Britchford

23/04/18

When Did Percy Main Depot Open

Can anyone help me I’m looking for the date Northern took over Percy Main depot from Wakefield Motors.

Karl Roper

24/04/18 – 06:37

Karl, if my information is correct.
Wakefields Motors Limited, were established in 1919, their depot was on Albion Road. North Shields, although the vehicle entrance was in Upper Camden Street.
In 1925, they became a subsidiary of the L.N.E.R (London North Easter Railway Company) They bought out Archer Brothers in 1929. In the same year, L.N.E.R bought a substantial share in NGT (Northern General transport) as part of the deal, Wakefields became part of the BET group, with control passing to NGT subsidiary Tynemouth & District. Henceforth, new vehicles would be numbered as part of the T&D fleet but with a W prefix, and all vehicles would be in T&D livery
I have no idea what Wakefields livery was
Wakefields had several joint operations with T&D, and initially the idea was to transfer all service operations to T&D, but retain the Wakefields name for Excursions and Private Hire work, however, the fly in the ointment was on some routes a third party was involved, and Wakefields licences on those routes would have to be surrendered and re-applied for, so the name was retained.
As far as I am Aware, Percy Main Depot opened in 1925, or there abouts. Wakefields depot was closed in 1933, and all vehicles were relocated to Percy Main.
In 1934, the remainder of Wakefields vehicles (pre 1929) were renumbered as part of the Percy Main fleet, but would also carry a W prefix, this practice was discontinued in 1952.
The name continued in use until 1970, when all remaining vehicles were renamed Tynemouth. By 1975, the NGT Group was now part of NBC, T&D and SDO Vehicle were all renamed Northern, Gateshead & District and Tyneside followed suit in 1976

Ronnie Hoye

07/04/18

History Enquiry

I am chairman of Bingham Heritage Trails Association, We are looking for anything on bus transport in Bingham (which is between Nottingham, Newark and Grantham)in the 1920s and 1930s. If you have any information we would be pleased to hear from you.

Geoff Ashton

08/04/18 – 07:24

I suggest you contact the Omnibus Society Library and Archive section –.
They have a good selection of Trent timetables covering the eras you are interested in; also Lincolnshire Road Car as well.

Bob Gell

08/04/18 – 10:32

The Omnibus Society turns out to be

Joe

09/04/18 – 07:57

Oops – my mistake! Thanks Joe.

Bob Gell

11/04/18 – 05:58

I am sure you know that in recent years (by which I mean up to the 1960s!!!!) Bingham was mainly served by the frequent Trent route 79A from Nottingham together the less frequent 79 Nottingham – Grantham service, which was jointly operated with Lincolnshire Road Car, who used the route no. 33C. Trent also ran an occasional route 82 to East Brdigford. There was a fairly frequent Bingham – Melton Mowbray service by Bartons (route 27). In addition, paragraph 3 of the attached link   shows that W Gash & Sons Nottingham – Newark service ran via Bingham in the 1930s, together with a rival route by Garrood, who were later acquired by Gash. Hope some of this helps, and I am not trying to "teach my granny to suck eggs"!

Stephen Ford

13/04/18 – 05:36

Subsequently Trent combined the Nottingham -Bingham service with a Derby- Nottingham service – the new route being numbered 102.
When I worked for Trent in the Travel Centre at Nottingham Victoria I used this service daily as I lived at Borrowash.

Malcolm Hirst

17/04/18 – 06:o5

I think so, but not during my time.
The Traffic Manager at the time ( Bill Gunning ) was a dab hand at linking services together to make round trips of a multiple of 60 minutes to reduce downtime at termini. After the merger of Trent and Midland General he managed to make a sizeable fleet reduction using this exercise.
His piece-de-resistance was a service from Nottingham to Clay Cross which was tantamount to going to the moon and back!

Michael Hirst

16/04/18 – 06:41

Malcolm
Didn’t at least some of the 102 journeys run through to Burton on Trent at one stage?

Bob Gell

17/04/18 – 06:05

I think so, but not during my time.
The Traffic Manager at the time ( Bill Gunning ) was a dab hand at linking services together to make round trips of a multiple of 60 minutes to reduce downtime at termini. After the merger of Trent and Midland General he managed to make a sizeable fleet reduction using this exercise.
His piece-de-resistance was a service from Nottingham to Clay Cross which was tantamount to going to the moon and back!

Michael Hirst

29/03/18

Bournemouth TD5’s

Do we have any photos of these magnificent buses in complete form (ie with roof on)? I seem to recall polished wood panelling & possibly mirrors on the lower deck front wall. Also I believe a slide open roof. Can anybody confirm these details (I could just be losing the plot!!) and is there a complete bus in preservation? It would be nice to think there was more than one.

David Field

30/03/18 – 07:41

If there isn’t one on OBP there is one here.

John Lomas, Chris Hebbron & Paul Haywood

03/04/18 – 06:51

There is a picture on page 66 of One Hundred Years of Roads and Rails around the Solent by David Fereday Glenn published 1991. Text also confirms that the vehicles had sun roofs.

Andy Hemming

27/03/18

The Life of LRO 981

Whilst browsing through a flickr link recently, I spotted a magnificent coach, LRO 981, but unfortunately, no details were given. It’s almost certainly pre-war but with a post war body. The radiator has a Bristol outline but I think it’s too wide so possibly a pre-war Guy. The bodywork has the look of Thurgood about it. The registration dates from 1950 so I assume it was re-registered when fitted with a new body. It was photographed when belonging to Hillside of Luton.
Does anyone know the history of this vehicle?

Chris Barker

27/03/18 – 08:12

Bus Lists on the Web show this as Bristol JO5G chassis 233, Thurgood C35F body number 645, new to Hillside, Markyate 05/1950

Les Dickinson

16/04/18 – 06:45

Thanks to Les for confirming that LRO was a Bristol JO5G but as such, it couldn’t possibly have been new in 1950. Does anyone know what it’s previous registration was and it’s original owner?

Chris Barker

17/04/18 – 06:25

The history of the chassis can be found in this link:

David Beilby

17/04/18 – 06:28

This vehicle began life as JN 7500, a Bristol JO5G chassis no. 233 with Eastern Counties B36R body no. 4333 that entered service with Westcliff-on-Sea Motor Services in 1936. In 1950, still with Westcliff, it was rebodied with Thurgood C35F body no. 645. Westcliff sold this (now) coach to Hillside Coaches, Markyate in 1954 who re-registered it LRO 981 with the fleet number 18. Nowadays, of course, the original registration would have been regarded as a cherished plate – how fashions change. Around 820 J type chassis were built up to 1937 when the L type took over in production. The main difference was the replacement of the midships mounted gearbox with one in unit with the engine. The history of this vehicle has been gleaned from the Bristol Vehicles Website,

Roger Cox

17/04/18 – 06:32

According to Gerry Tormey’s website (Bristol SU) chassis JO5G 233 was originally a Westcliff on Sea single deck bus with B36R body registered JN 7500.
Presumably the rebodying would have included fitting a 5 speed gearbox otherwise the poor coach would have had a top speed in the low 30s mph.

John Grigg

17/04/18 – 06:25

Googling reveals that this bus started life in 1936 with Westcliff on Sea Motor Services registration JN 7500. They had it rebodied in 1950 as a coach, having had an Eastern Counties B36R body. In c.1954 reappears with Markyate as LRO 981… and then?

Joe

17/04/18 – 06:43

Bus lists on the web does not do pre war,but the entry for this vehicle will have come from his lists of new bodies.
Often previous identities will be annotated where this is known, but in this case he has probably not seen any records.
Often only PSV Circle news sheets have this information and not always!

Michael Hirst

20/04/18 – 06:58

Thanks to everyone for the information, if I have it correctly, this vehicle was rebodied in 1950 and sold to Hillside in 1954 and they then re-registered it with a registration appropriate to the date of it’s rebuilding, very odd!
The thing which struck me about it’s second incarnation was that it had been fitted with a sort of dish shaped fender (for want of a better word) below the radiator, which looked about four inches deep and was bolted to the dumb irons on each side. It softened the appearance of the high set Bristol rad and made a very impressive looking coach!

Chris Barker

22/04/18 – 05:47

Chris,
I think that is more likely that JN 7500 was rebodied AND re-registered in 05/1950 by Thurgood of Ware in Hertfordshire, hence the Hertfordshire registration LRO 981.
I think that it was pure fate that it ended up in Hertfordshire at Markyate in 1954.
No such thing as a date-related re-registration in those days, I guess.
We need someone with a Westcliff-on-Sea fleet history to prove that it remained in service from 1950 with the registration LRO 981, or a photo.

Dave Farrier

22/04/18 – 09:10

The LRO xxx series of registrations were issued from January to April 1950, which is pretty firm evidence that the re-registration took place at the time it was re-bodied.

David Hick

24/03/18

Old Coach Park

I hope you don’t mind me contacting you, as I have come across your website while trying to solve a local history problem. You may know that before the M62 was built, coaches travelling from Yorkshire to the Fylde coast used to come through Burnley where I live. I think this was mainly in the 1960’s. There is a pub in the Lowerhouse area of Burnley called the Lane Ends. At that time the Lane Ends Coach park opposite the pub was a very frequent stopping off point. It was always very busy. There were toilets, a cafe, and the pub used to half fill pints of beer ready for the tourists. Apparently the pub was absolutely packed, so the Landlady used to look out for local faces and pull their beer in between serving the others. I am told by an old gentleman I know that there were at times 40 and 50 coaches at once. We have been trying for years to find any photos of the coach park to no avail. I have recently contacted the Chairman of Burnley Historical Society, who found some pictures of the pub, but none of the coach park. I have asked lots of elderly locals, who all remember it well, but again, no photos. A friend of mine says he took lots of photos for people on the coaches with their cameras, but they probably ended up back in Yorkshire. The Coach Park closed when the M62 opened creating a shorter route to the coast. It then became a derelict car park and a place for the pub bonfire. It was eventually sold off and houses built on it. Part of the reason I am trying to solve this is because a good friend of mine is a very keen bus and steam train fan, and he is 70 in May. It would absolutely make his birthday, if I could get a photo for him.

Graham Taylor

19/03/18

Osmonds of Curry Rivel

Osmonds had numerous school contracts in the area around Curry Rivel, including from Hutchings and Cornelius territory, Barrington to Ilminster. I travelled on their buses from 1958 to 1963.
Can anyone direct me to pictures of this fleet of long serving workhorses? As I write the registration KYC 4 came into my head but it was a long time ago.

Richard Burton

21/03/18 – 05:52

There are a couple of pics here.

John Lomas

19/03/18

Robin Hood, Nottingham

For many years, all the vehicles bought new by this operator were given registration numbers which ended in 9, indeed all those which eventually passed to Barton were amongst these.Does anyone know if Mr Dennis (of Robin Hood) had a particular reason for requesting such numbers?

Les Dickinson

05/03/18

Albion EAD 731

I took a picture of Albion EAD 731 when hitch-hiking through Cheltenham from RAF Hereford in 1956. Can anyone give me details; it looked like a Weymann body to me.

Michael Baker

05/03/18 – 15:03

Yes a Weymann body to H30/26R configuration. New to Cheltenham and District in February 1940.

Stephen Howarth

24/02/18

Leyland LT5A, Registered WJ 3558

Hopefully someone with either good records or encyclopaedic knowledge will be able to point me in the right direction concerning a Leyland old london photos black and white LT5A, registered WJ 3558. It is believed to have been delivered new to Sheffield Joint Omnibus Committee in 1932 as their no. 218. Its next known appearance was with what was said to be an Allsopp coach body, and what appeared to be a "Covrad" conversion, which may or may not have been in connection with the fitting of an oil engine, with Blake of Delabole in Cornwall in November 1941. It spent 7 years with Blake, before being sold on to another Cornish operator Pelere of Penryn, until they withdrew it in November 1952. Presumably it was then scrapped.
Can any of the expert Yorkshire Municipal contributors to this site, provide any more information please, including whether the body was the original on this chassis.
There are some excellent photos of it, believed to have been taken in 1941, on the "Nostalgic Truro" website

John Grigg

25/02/18 – 11:05

Interesting, Charles Halls encyclopaedic record of Sheffield Transport indeed has this fleet number and registration as one of a batch of 7 (215-221) listed but as a 1932, all Leyland, TS4 with B30R bodywork.Year of disposal is shown as 1938, disposal details not shown.
It may be relevant to note that there were 16 similar spec TS4’s that year and all went in 1938/9 along with 6 x all Leyland TD2’s and an ex demo TD2c bought at the same time.

Andrew Charles

09/02/18

John Bull (Tideswell)

Does anyone remember a coach operator by the name of John Bull hailing from, if my memory serves me correctly, Tideswell, Derbyshire?
Around 1970, I was given, out of the blue, the rare opportunity to co-drive what may have been a Tiger Cub with Duple body of the John Bull fleet. Nothing rare about that, you may say, except that the trip was to the South of France with a party of Manchester University lecturers.
My enduring memory of the drive relates to the Heath Robinson means of engaging overdrive via a domestic light switch which swung around below the steering wheel on the end of a piece of braided flex. Try doing that on the French pave in the dark!

David Cooper

09/02/18 – 17:00

Neville Mercer’s book Super Prestige 38 gives a good account of this operator which later became G W Bull, selling to White’s of Calver on the death of Mr G Bull senior in 1988. I currently have a list of 14 vehicles operated by Bull over the years the list may not be complete but does not include a Tiger Cub.

Les Dickinson

11/02/18 – 06:30

I can remember there coaches used to be garaged next to The Anchor Inn at Lane Head, Tideswell in the mid 1980’s

Roger Broughton

12/02/18 – 07:07

The 1971/72 edition of the "Little Red Book" gives Bull as owning 3 Bedfords, 1 AEC and 1 Ford Transit.
I’ve no idea what the Transit was.
I cannot trace a Bristol LHL registered OXB399H, unless it was an import from Ireland that was re-registered.

Dave Farrier

13/02/18 – 06:01

Here’s a good detective story in the making.
It certainly seems to be 1970ish registration and XB is London. But did it have a life before that?
Why would anyone with an NI registration change it unless it was "distinctive" and valuable. It’s usually the other were round. Why register it in London when it resided in Derbyshire? Was that possible? Were there any of these coaches ever registered in the Irish Republic?
Over to you, inspector!

Joe

13/02/18 – 08:16

There was an OXG 399H which would seem to fit the description – it was a Bristol LHL6L with Plaxton C51F body new to Calvert and Skelton, Eston.

David Beilby

20/03/18 – 16:30

OXB 399H was actually OXG 399H.
C712 LWE went on to last a very long time after the demise of John Bull. It passed to Whites Travel and Calver and, in turn, when Whites were in turn bought out by Chesterfield Transport it continued there as No. 198. When Stagecoach (East Midland) took over the coaching operations at Chesterfield and Calver were closed down. During my time running the coaching operation there, 198 was earning much more than coaches on front line work as it spent its’ days pottering around the Peaks dropping off and picking up walkers working for specialist holiday companies. So although John Bull disappeared back in 1988, it wasn’t until 1996 that his last vehicle stopped working. I don’t know what became of it sadly.

Bill Headley

24/03/18 – 06:55

The operator was always GEORGE BULL, never John Bull. My book on Derbyshire independents has the full story as related in part by a surviving daughter-in-law of the founder. The family concentrated on its farming activities after the death of the founder and sold the coaching business to White of Calver. White kept the Bull trading name for a few years before blending its activities into the main business. Older readers may remember that Bull once operated a stage carriage service from Tideswell to Millers Dale Station. By the time the station closed to passenger traffic this had dwindled to one journey in each direction, Mon-Fri only, timed to suit commuters.

Neville Mercer

25/01/18

Coloured Destination Blinds

Barrow CT used coloured destination blinds (red, yellow, blue and green as well as normal black/white). This came over from the trams in the 1930’s and continued well into the 1960’s.
Anyone aware of anywhere else where this was done please?

Stuart Emmett

26/01/18 – 04:57

Bolton springs to mind, on the Atlanteans, but not earlier stock.

Pete Davies

26/01/18 – 04:58

I believe that Bournemouth Corporation sometimes used coloured blinds for certain routes or occasions. I am only going on long-term memory, but I think the destination roll had some places in a colour (not all), and later buses had a second number aperture – this too sometimes used a coloured display. This is in the era of the 1960s, possibly into the 1970s. Sorry I can’t be more specific.

Michael Hampton

26/01/18 – 04:59

Bournemouth used coloured via blinds – a blue background for when the service ran "via Old Christchurch Road", and a red background for when the service ran "via Bath and Westover Roads" – services had these two alternative routes near the town centre. In addition, a green background was used for services "via the Central Station", or "via Ashley Road", whilst an orange background was used for the "via Brassey Road" routes. (In each case the lettering in quote marks above was white,. In later years, only the red or blue blinds seemed to be in use.

Peter Delaney

26/01/18 – 11:11

I don’t know when the practice started, but certainly as far back as the early 60’s, NGT were using coloured destination blinds on their longer express service routes.

Ronnie Hoye

27/01/18 – 06:16

Doncaster CT ran two trolleybus routes on the eastern side, one to Beckett Road and one to Wheatley Hills. The two buses always ran together, nose to rear through the town centre until, I assume, the routes divided. The Wheatley Hills blinds were in red on black, but as the two buses were always together (did this save electricity?) in the same order, I have no real idea why?

Joe

27/01/18 – 06:18

Different-coloured blinds/lights/liveries usually started with trams to help illiterate folk of the day to pick the correct route they wanted. London E1 trams had three or four small spot lights above the destination box which lit in different combinations according to route. Most were blanked off as the years went by, but you can still see the blank area in photos. The 1930’s Felthams didn’t.
London Transport’s Green Line services pre-war and just post-war sported blinds with white lettering on a black background, but, from about mid-1946, sported black lettering on an amber background, but, at the top, had a strip of amber lettering spelling out GREEN LINE on a black background.
None of this was helpful to me: I’m colour-blind!
I also recall a short-lived express service, in the early 1950’s, from Morden Tube Station to Epsom (I think), using RT’s with blue destination blinds, with the additional word EXPRESS on them.

Chris Hebbron

28/01/18 – 06:45

Didn’t LT, early ’70s, use blue blinds for "limited stop" services (615, Poplar – St Paul’s; 616, Oxford Circus[?] – Cricklewood) including the Red Arrow services?
Burnley & Pendle used blue blinds, certainly in the 80s – they were thought to reduce glare and make the white lettering more visible at night-time.
Latterly, Bolton used a three-track number display alongside two destination displays: one was white-on black to display the outer terminus, and one was white-on-green to display the inner terminus (usually "Bolton", even though there were different termini within the town). The inward blinds had originally been red, until the Chief Constable of Lancashire/Bolton Borough police pointed out that it was illegal to display a red light to the front of a road vehicle.
... However, I recall some United Bovas running on National Express duties with red destination blinds.
Many of the London sightseeing companies have used coloured blinds to differentiate on which tour/feeder service the bus is employed – and this has carried forward into the digital era.
I’ve got a late listing for a coloured Barrow blind – I’ll post it here, if I can find it...

Philip Rushworth

28/01/18 – 11:53

In August 1955 London Transport introduced a peak period (the Sat service only lasted a year) 130 Express service between New Adddington and East Croydon, later West Croydon, and this ran until replaced by the C1 and C2 in 1970. The blinds on these services carried white lettering on a blue background.

Roger Cox

28/01/18 – 11:53

Hants and Dorset used red blinds to display a message to the effect that the service could not be used by passengers travelling wholly within the Bournemouth Corporation Transport area.
Probably the most common use of coloured blinds was by Green Line – black lettering on a yellow (or was it nearer buff?) background.

Andy Hemming

30/01/18 – 05:23

Thanks so much for all the contributions so far, and the most comprehensive seems to have been Barrow CT. The blind colours, introduced in 1934, that were still being used in 1961 and beyond, were as follows:
• green background with white letters,
• red background with white letters,
• yellow background with black letters/or yellow background with white letters
• blue background with white letters,
where no colours were used, then normal, white on black screens were used.
There were only five main services inside the city boundary so they had them all covered (in colour)!

Stuart Emmett

31/01/18 – 05:44

Thx David/Phil/Mike, for the explanation. Unusual to use the first letter of the street name as a suffix. Portsmouth Corporation had a route 143 whose suffixes went from A to F. The higher the letter, the shorter part of the route travelled.
London Transport also used them and, in one case at least, the 77/77A, the 77 disappeared many years before the 77A.

Chris Hebbron

01/02/18 – 07:01

Further to my earlier post, and Stuart’s last post a late Barrow destination blind was Private, Football Ground, Shipyard, Steelworks, West Shore, North Scale, Cemetary, St. James, Devonshire Road, Ormsgill (Y), Harrell Lane (Y), Roose (B), Tea House (B), Ship Inn, Rainey Park, Town Hall, St. Aloysius, Abbey (G), Biggar Bank (G), Amphitrite St (G), Black Butts Lane, Hawcoat, The Shore (R), Southampton St (R), Promenade, Hawcoat Lane, White House, Friars Lane, Washington, Docks, Oxford St, Newbarns, Risedale Road, Barrow, Dalton, Swarthmoor, Ulverston, Rampside, Roa Island, Goadsbarrow, Baycliffe, Bardsea.
There are only twelve intermediate points listed on the "via" blind, so I’m assuming a lot of the above must have been short-workings on the same line of route. I understand that the coloured blinds were to help those who weren’t able to read identify there bus, but the system must have been of limited use if more than than one destination shared the same coloured background, and given the large number of routes must have had black backgrounds.
Shout if you want me to list the accompanying "via" blind...

Philip Rushworth

02/02/18 – 05:46

Yes Phillip many thanks and have seen that blind, actually from the early 1950’s, when for example, from 1949 to 1958, Barrow received 60 Leyland deckers all with similar coloured blinds. I also seem to recall the 10 deckers from 1961 did not have coloured blinds and after 1961, then single deckers mainly “ruled” and without coloured blinds.
Meanwhile, in 1955 there had been changes to the routes/colours and for example, the ‘red’ Hawcoat now went to Newbarns and the ‘red’ Shore now went to Rainey Park; so, both the new destys of Newbarns and Rainey Park were then black and white.
You are indeed correct that many of the B/W destys on the early 50′ blinds covered ‘shorts’ with the only official "full" black/white blind ‘end’ route being the West Shore (extension from North Scale), North Scale to Cemetery, with the shorts to St. James and Devonshire Road.
All the other B/W blinds were either generic e.g. such as Dockyard, or were shorts to common destinations that were shared with other coloured blinds routes (so the use of a colour could be confusing) or, were the two non-City longer routes to Ulverston (that were not former tram routes and not in the coloured blind scheme).
If you need a link to what was on which route do please let me know, (they are mainly in order related to the colour from the blind you listed).
I have never really subscribed to the illiterate theory still being used on coloured blinds, in the 1950’s; as Barrow would not have a monopoly on such people? But then why should Barrow use it on all their City routes? I have no official answer, but it seems to me this was merely a carryover from the 1930’s and was, therefore, more about ‘we have always done it this way’.
I for one like that!
Finally, the via blinds in white on black that were commonly used were Town Hall, Circular, Abbey Road, Greengate Street (for the Newbarns route), Coast Road (for the Ulverston Coast Road route), Dalton (for the direct Ulverston route) and Ship Inn (for the Roose route). I would indeed be pleased to see ‘your full set of 12 vias’ = thanks in advance Phillip

Stuart Emmett

03/02/18 – 05:02

Stuart, the "via" blind list is: via Teesdale Road, via Blake St [sic[, via Devonshire Road, via Town Centre [sic], via Farm Street, via Dalton. via Roa Island, via Coast Road, via Abbey Road, Cellophane [sic], Ship Inn [sic], via Holker Street, via Ramsden St [sic], via Greengate St [sic].

Philip Rushworth

05/02/18 – 06:04

Hull Corporation Transport used white blinds with black lettering and numbers from July 1937 for its trolleybus routes to make them more recognisable. they were replaced by a new standard layout in normal blackblinds after the War. It took time to phase them out and several adorned the box over the platform well into the 1950s. The last one appears to be worn by Sunbeam bo. 80 in 1955 (see Keith Eastonn’s post in 2014) The original numbers 65 (Anlaby Road) and 66 (Dairycoates) were changed to 69 and 70. I don’t know if the 61A and 62A were altered to 65 and 66. The original Anlaby Road blind still showed Wheeler Street as the destination!

Malcolm Wells

05/02/18 – 06:06

In the 1960/70s Western Welsh adopted Yellow on Black for the number tracks whilst destinations remained White on Black.
However, I recall an article on the company in ‘Classic Bus’ a few years ago that showed they also used Black on Yellow on some single deckers.

Orla Nutting

Rochdale Bus with a Predictive Gearbox

I wondered if you might be able to help me. My grandad turns 90 in February and, because he used to drive buses in Rochdale in the 1950’s, his one wish is to drive/ride on one again. He can’t travel very far so he would need to access one near to Rochdale. Do you know of any contacts of people or companies who own one in the north west area?
Any advice/ideas greatly appreciated!

Sarah

26/01/18 – 04:44

Your best bet is to contact the Greater Manchester Transport Museum at Boyle Street.

Stephen Howarth

26/01/18 – 04:46

I have never studied the gearbox types of Rochdale Corporation’s buses, others may be able to help regarding that subject. What I am able to contribute is that Museum of Transport (Boyle Street, Manchester, M8 8UW) has two former Rochdale Corporation buses in its collection which are: 235 (HDK 835), an East Lancs bodied AEC Regent III new in 1951

280 (NDK 980), a Weymann bodied AEC Regent V new in 1956

www.ipernity.com/doc/davidslater-three
It may be that bus 280 is the type your Grandad remembers.
The Museum has open days when it is possible to travel on certain exhibits. Their website is at

David Slater

26/01/18 – 08:10

I seem to have missed the second part of my answer off yesterday.
I think the type of gearbox referred to is the "Pre-selector" gearbox, of which Rochdale Corporation had a quantity in the fleet.

Stephen Howarth

27/01/18 – 06:07

Thanks for the explanation, Stephen: I had visions of it changing gear to what it thought it should be!

Joe

27/01/18 – 06:09

I can confirm that both of the Rochdale buses referred to by David Slater, 235 and 280, have pre-selective gearboxes.

Peter Williamson

28/01/18 – 11:56

Thank you so much to everyone who has commented. I will follow-up on the suggestions made. Great picture of the bus near Rochdale Town Hall with ‘Bacup’ as the destination!

Sarah

29/01/18 – 06:32

Rochdale bus 235 is on route 17T. Why the T suffix, which seems remarkably high compared with normal suffixes?

Chris Hebbron

30/01/18 – 05:08

The ‘T’ suffix on Rochdale’s buses indicated that the service ran via Tweedale Street. The range of suffix letters most regularly used were A, C and T. There was limited use of B and D. The route of the Rochdale-Sudden-Castleton-Manchester service 17 (jointly run by Rochdale and Manchester Corporations) was via Drake Street which was parallel to Tweedale Street. Rochdale Corporation ran its own ‘shorts’ from the town centre as far as the Borough boundary at Castleton (Chesham Avenue). These travelled via Tweedale Street and were designated 17T. (There had been limited use at peak times for a variant travelling via the Esplanade and Manchester Road numbered 17A). Conversely (well almost), the route of the Rochdale-Sudden-Bury service (jointly run by Rochdale and Bury Corporations) was via Tweedale Street and this showed service number 21 or 21T. Bury Corporation regularly showed 21T whereas the Rochdale Corporation buses might have shown either! (There had also been limited use of two peak hour variants for Sudden or Heywood shorts that travelled along Drake Street (21D) or via the Esplanade and Manchester Road (21A)). An interesting aside to the ‘T’ suffix system was the joint service 23T from Rochdale via Tweedale Street to Sudden, Bury and Bolton run by the three Corporations of Rochdale, Bury and Bolton. This through service was discontinued in 1939 at the outbreak of the War. After the War the through service was not resumed but the service number 23T was retained by Bury and Bolton Corporations for the service between those towns even though it no longer came anywhere near Tweedale Street in Rochdale! I believe this was the case right up until the SELNEC route renumbering of the early 1970s. Rochdale Corporation had quite a few services with suffix letters to differentiate variations of its routes. Prominent were the all day Norden services 11A and 11C which travelled from the town centre to Spotland Bridge via either Spotland Road or Mellor Street respectively. This was also the case with the Spotland services 12A and 12C (although the 12C was only run at peak hours for the factories) and for the shorts towards Norden that terminated at Bagslate. These mainly ran via Mellor Street and showed 9C with few, if any, ever travelling via Spotland Road. Services travelling in the direction of Smallbridge bound for Littleborough or Wardle would show the â’A’ suffix if travelling via John Street and Yorkshire Street. No suffix would be shown if they travelled via Entwistle Road. It all sounds complicated now but seemed to work well at the time. I don’t think Rochdale saw many tourists that might be confused with the system! When industry was very buoyant some of the large factories like Turner Brothers at Spotland; or the large engineering works in different parts of the town; or cotton mills along Queensway and Castleton etc would see a fair quantity of buses waiting at the factories at finishing time with a variety of different route numbers on display. The buses would generally all travel through the town centre from where they would then continue on the displayed service number as a normal peak hour extra thus offering a wide range of though cross town facilities for the workers.

David Slater

30/01/18 – 05:09

The T suffix was originally to signify buses entering Rochdale through Tweedale St. When the Bolton to Rochdale through service, which operated by Tweedale St, was split into three during WW2, Bolton operated the section between Bolton town centre and Breightmet, the route number was retained without the T. For services that were extended to Bury the T, still on the blinds for the original through service, was used for Bolton to Bury trips, a case of one operator using an existing blind designed for another operator’s requirement, for their own needs.

Phil Blinkhorn

30/01/18 – 05:10

Hi Chris, interesting comment about 17T suffix. The T suffix showed that the service was a short working from Rochdale centre to the Middleton boundary at Chesham Avenue and that it travelled inward and outward via Tweedale Street rather than Drake Street as the 17 to Manchester did. It therefore passed the railway station. There were other "T" services – 21T from Rochdale to Bury via Heywood. I believe also, that the 23T which latterly was a Bury/Bolton joint service, originally ran as a service starting in Rochdale but was curtailed to Bury during the war, the number remaining and even featuring once in a Victoria Wood sketch! The 17T was the preserve latterly of the elderly Daimlers. The other 17 short working in Rochdale was the 17A which travelled outward via Drake Street and terminated at Albion Street, Castleton.

Mike Baron

22/01/18

Query of Date

My dad Fred Baker was mechanic at AWC when I was a lad. My query is when did Wigmores begin their Sheffield service? Hoping someone is able to help.

Morris Baker

20/01/18

What Does RT Stand for?

Programme letters were allocated by AEC to its orders the Minutes of the Joint Engineering Committee (AEC and LPTB) refer to ‘Programme RT’. For those interested, a list of the programme codes allocated follow. The allocation of letters to different batches of STLs varies but later models were ‘programmed’ in alphabetical order.

Tony Beard

Quantity Type Code AEC Programme Code 58 2STL FG 39 4STL FS 50 3STL FH 50 6STL GJ 50 6STL FS 50 7STL GJ 11 5STL FS 100 7STL GT 50 7STL HJ 80 8STL HK 80 5Q KG 50 6Q MQ 50 9T MS 266 10T QJ 132 15STL RN 1 16STL Later 1RT RT 150 2RT SY 188 2RT UB

18/01/18

Manchester Airport Coach Service in the 50’s

I’m trying to find out when the airport service started and finished, what vehicle were used and how many in the fleet, I can’t find any info online, only the odd photo but no dates or info with them.

Ivan Gleaves

18/01/18 – 08:44

A very useful place to start would be the fleet list/history created by Peter Gould:

David Slater

19/01/18 – 05:24

The MCTD service to Manchester Airport started with a service to the then airport at Barton in 1935 using one of the staff cars. The LMS had a big investment in Railway Air Services which served Barton and they asked for a bus service. The unique Crossley Delta with a 3.8 litre petrol engine and a streamlined 20 seat Crossley bodied, fleet number 6 provided a luxury service from the city centre. It was painted blue and cream. When Ringway opened in 1938 the coach continued in use but when war came it was sent to the Corporation’s home for epiletics after proving too troublesome in stage carriage service due to its large hinged door It was auctioned off in 1946 and went for scrap.
When civil flying resumed in 1946 the MCTD Car Works rebuilt 1938 Leyland TS8 Tiger 64 from B32R to C20R, painted it blue and cream with silver mouldings. It operated from a temporary building at the corner of Oxford St and Lower Mosley St. It was joined by fellow vehicles of the same batch as follows: 10/46 98 C20R converted by Metro Cammell.
9/49 79 and 79 C20R converted by Stockport Mfg Co and the Car Works.
4/50 89 C30F converted by Bond Wythenshawe.
5/50 99 C30F converted by County Motors Leigh.
7/50 97 C30F converted by County Motors Leigh.
All received high backed seats, heaters and a boot plus the blue and cream scheme with aluminium mouldings. The operated for specific flights and also saw service on private hires.
They were withdrawn as follows:
64 7/53 78 12/53 79 7/53 89 2/54 97 3/54 98 12/53 99 /54
A new city terminus was opened at the Royal Exchange in Exchange St in 1950. In 1953 six Leyland Royal Tigers were delivered with bodies to the design Park Royal had built on AEC Regal chassis for BEA. The vehicles were deemed to have infringed London Transport’s patent for the design so a small royalty was paid for each vehicle. The frames were built by Burlingham which finished three, being 33-35 the other three were finished by Bond being 30-32. All were C41F with the floor being split between lower level at the front and raised over the boot to the rear. Finished in dark blue lower body and light blue upper, separated by a thin silver band, they carried destination blinds including, not only airline names and the destinations for flights, as each journey was assigned to a flight, but also a number of Parrs Wood’s depots route destinations as very rarely they were pressed into stage carriage work. 30-32 were withdrawn 1/67, 33 and 34 4/68 and 35 5/67. Four more were acquired in August 1956 on Tiger Cub chassis, the heaviest version of that chassis built. The body was similar, this time all four were built by Burlingham and adorned with the same attractive colour scheme and destination blinds.
They were all withdrawn 1/69 having legally passed to SELNEC.
In 1959 the terminal was moved from Royal Exchange to Chorlton St and the service was run on a regular headway instead of being tied to specific flights.

Phil Blinkhorn

20/01/18 – 09:52

Just to correct an error in my previous post, the last four Tiger Cubs 36-39 did not pass to SELNEC on 1/69 as that body was not formed until April that year. They were sold by MCTD.

Phil Blinkhorn

21/01/18 – 06:18

Further to Phil Blinkhorns’ comment on the formation of SELNEC PTE. SELNEC started operating on 1st November 1969 not in April. I think he may be getting confused with GMPTE which was formed in April 1974.

Stephen Howarth

21/01/18 – 09:24

No, Stephen, SELNEC came into being on April 1 1969. It took over the operation of the bus fleets of its constituent operators on November 1 1969.

Phil Blinkhorn

18/01/18

Liecestershire Independent Stage Carriage Operators 1955-1965

Could anyone supply me with a list of independent stage carriage operators based in Liecestershire who were operating services in the period 1955-1965

Geoff Clayton

18/01/18

1920s/30s Ripon Services

Let me apologise first of all, as this question is primarily because I’m building a railway layout……. hope that offends nobody here!
The layout embraces Ripon, Masham and Melmerby stations, and I wanted to include a model bus or three – well why wouldn’t I! The date is 1929/30, but I cannot find clear info on what company would have been running buses or the types or liveries, at that time in those places. I understand Clarkes ran coaches, but don’t know the livery; Wrays of Dacre crop up. Were West Yorkshire Road Car in Ripon? or United? And if so in what livery/types? Any info most gratefully appreciated.

T Nutford

26/01/18 – 05:04

West Yorkshire ran to Ripon from Harrogate. United had a depot at Ripon and they ran services to Masham, Middleham and on to Leyburn I think the route will have been covered by United Automobile. I am sorry I can not help with the type of vehicles they used.

Brian Lunn

05/12/17

Buses with Showmen

I recently posted a shot of a Gilford ex Ideal Service in use with a showman. I have a couple of books of showmen’s vehicles but my question is whether any book or listing/register exists that deals just with those that are ex buses or coaches? If not, is there anyone on this site with sufficient knowledge to start such a project? I imagine there would be a ready market for any book covering this subject as there would be for similar books covering buses & coaches with contractors and indeed one that dealt with the vast number that were with the National Coal Board and its agents in its heyday. My own knowledge is thin but I would gladly contribute to such a project or help in the research that goes with it!

Les Dickinson

13/11/17

Bradford Trolleybus Jubilee 1961

Does anyone remember the tour route with 603/687/787? I recall City to Eccleshill to Bolton Junction to Dudley Hill to Holme Wood but after that? Any comments appreciated as am wanting to write up a short article.

Stuart Emmett

18/05/17

Leyland TD1 RX 1754

I am curious to learn a former Thames Valley Leyland TD1 (RX 1754) which was new to Thames Valley as No. 165. It carried a Leyland "Titan" which had actually been built by Short Brothers. Late in its’ career it was pictured with a showman – the only photo I have seen is copyrighted – and the roof on the vehicle has been lowered to the waist height of the upper deck. I would appreciate it if anyone can tell me about its’ history with the showman. It was also pictured with a former Belfast Omnibus Company/NIRTB AEC Regal AZ 8551. Any information would be appreciated.

Bill Headley

06/04/17

Midland.Mog

I’m presently compiling for the OS a publication called Midland.Mog, the history of the bus garages, tram depots etc in the Midlands. I’m having trouble finding detail for the period 1986 (after D-Day) to c2005, in particular for Stevenson (Uttox) and Mid Red North/East, then Arriva.
Does any contributor have any data of this kind? I can send lists by email for checking.

David Domin

17/02/17

Guy Arab II

I am looking for some help please, I am currently restoring a Guy Arab II dating from 1947 clutch and flywheel fitted to the Gardner 6LW engine, does anyone have a service manual for this vehicle?
This vehicle is in Spain and is left hand drive.
Any help anyone can give me would be fantastic.

James Lea

16/02/17

Alpha Coaches

Does anyone here have any recollection of a company that operated around the Tottenham/Hornsey area of North London under the name of ‘Alpha Coaches’? I remember them as a rather rag-bag collection of differing makes painted white(ish) and dark green and run on a shoe-string. We used them as the price was right for our fishing trips. I believe the rather colourful proprietor was a chap we knew as ‘Charlie’ who owned two old Bentleys and lived in Woodlands Park Road. I know it’s not entirely a figment of my imagination as there is a fleeting glimpse of one on a YouTube video!

Peter Morris

08/02/17

DMS in Calveley, Cheshire?

On my way back from Showbus last summer I was travelling along the A51 towards Tarporley. As I passed through Calveley travelling on Phil McAlinney’s excellent ex-Barton DAF, we saw a DMS and another decker parked behind a house just before the railway bridge. I haven’t seen these vehicles since – can anyone shed any light on this pair and what they are?

Bill Headley

13/01/17

Southport No62

I am currently researching the history of EWM 358 a Daimler CWA 6 Southport Corp Fleet No62.
What I know is, First reg 27th Feb 1945. Supplied new to Southport Corporation and was in service until 1953/54.
Bought By Wilf Blundell of Southport 1957.
Where was it in between these dates???
I know that Wilf Blundell used it on his fleet before it ended up at Aintree Race course, where I assume it smashed its engine. Does anyone have any information on this period or Photos at Aintree???
I also know it was later purchased by a solicitor, which is how it came to reside in the Nortwest Transport Museum In St Helens.
Any information would be greatly appreciated.

John P

08/01/17

Drysdales of Cupar

Any information on Drysdales of Cupar in Fife Scotland, For my first year at High School 1964 to 65. We were ferried between Cupar and Newburgh in a couple of tired Leyland Titans. Drysdales also had a coach for the senior School students possibly a Bedford Duple.

Ian Brunton

02/01/17

LTE 335 an AEC Regal

Can anyone please help me out with change of ownership reference LTE 335 new to Barnes of Rawtenstall in 1950 an AEC Regal III.

Alan Coulson

10/12/16

Ribble Single Decker

I am looking for a photo of a red ‘Ribble’ bus, single decker, from the WW2 era. The type I need was in service between Kirkby Lonsdale and Kendal at that time.

Ken Humphris

08/11/16

Hants & Dorset Depots

Does anyone have any information relating to Hants & Dorset depot allocations in the period 1956 to 1971?
I am compiling a listing largely from memory and would therefore value any input to supplement this increasingly unreliable source!!!

Peter Elliott

17/07/16

SHMD Thornycroft Decker

Could anyone please confirm that a former SHMD Thornycroft double decker ended up as a mobile office at Birkenhead docks. I saw one there in the 1960’s and I was told that it had been a SHMD vehicle. I think it had a Northern Counties body.

Bob Griffiths

16/03/16

Bedford Coach NGR 603

Can anyone please help me out with details of A Bedford coach registration NGR 603 a C5ZI with a Duple body a C29F coach chassis number 4794, it was new to R.W.Carney of Sunderland in 3/1960. I have unconfirmed detail it was in a collision and scrapped. I ask are details recorded anywhere, this coach may have been at Carneys throughout its working life. Any information be greatly appreciated.

Alan Coulson

29/02/16

H W Hunter Photos

By any chance, does anyone out there have a photo of either of these with their original bodies? I have both in rebodied form. They were new to H W Hunter and Sons of Seaton Delaval. The first, CNL 425; is a 1948 C33F Burlingham bodied Leyland PS1/1, rebodied by Plaxton in 1956 as C33F. The second is EJR 791; which has been featured on these pages, it is a PSU1/15 Leyland Royal Tiger, and had a C41C Burlingham Seagull body, it was rebodied by Plaxton in 1958 as C43F. I believe its still around somewhere in Ireland. Any help would be much appreciated.

Ronnie Hoye

26/02/16

Buses & the Distinctive Andover Bus Station

During the 1950’s and mid 1960’s, I went to school at Andover secondary school for boys. I remember the bus station, Wilts & Dorset buses from school days, the low level double deck buses, I have visited Andover on several occasions and the library etc to try and find some history or photo’s.
It would be really nice if someone has info on the buses & the distinctive Andover bus station.
I came across the excellent Old Bus web site and hoped someone could help.
Many thanks.

Stephen Palmer

04/12/15

Ballieston Old Bus Depot

I have a friend who wants a photo of the Eastern Scottish Depot at Ballieston, Scotland. I have tried to locate a photo, but sadly no luck. The depot was demolished some years ago. Has anyone got a shot any clues how to get one

David Thorpe

16/11/15

Western SMT Distinctive Lowbridge Double Decker

In the 1950s Western SMT used a distinctive Lowbridge double-deck bus exclusively on the Paisley Cotton Street to Glenburn route passing under a low bridge at Falside Road. The red bus had a very unusual sloping front at the roofline which made it very easy to spot from afar as you ran to a bus stop, distinguishing it from many other red buses. Does anyone have any information about what model of bus this was or any photographs as I cannot trace anything about this bus.

James Renfrew

09/08/15

East Yorkshire Motor Services in Tadcaster

1. I have several photos of EYMS vehicles from the 1950s, mostly ex-Everingham Bros, parked outside The Tadcaster Tower Brewery. Judging by their blind settings, I have always assumed that these were non-timetabled ‘works services’ to and from the York area, perhaps continuing an agreement made previously between Everingham Bros. and Hammonds Brewery of Bradford (Hammonds Ales) who had owned the brewery since 1946. Does anyone have the facts?

2. One of these ‘works services’ is parked next to a bus stop with a large display which reads: ‘East Yorkshire – Newcastle via Northallerton, Darlington, Durham – Queue This Side’. This is very confusing because the only known EYMS scheduled services via Tadcaster were Leeds to Hull and Leeds to Bridlington. The Hull to Newcastle express service ran directly northwards to Easingwold after leaving York, and not south-west to Tadcaster! Can anyone resolve this mystery?

Malcolm Burke

12/07/15

R W Carney NGR 601 & NGR 602

As I trace more history of R.W.Carney also known as Carney Coaches of Sunderland.
I ask can anyone help with the history of ownership after Carneys of the following coaches NGR 601 & NGR 602. These being AEC Reliance Brittiana Coaches new to them in 3/1960 both being 41 seaters with Sunderland registrations.
I would be grateful for any information, all I have to date is 602 leaving Carneys 5/1968 to Sutherlands of Lairg & late in 12/1968 it is seen at Garlochead Coaches Scotland withdrawn by them in 3/1970. Information is taken from photo’s obtained dates are therefore approximate.
These two coaches were the first of many luxury coaches purchased new in 1960’s for use on private hire. With routine maintenance these gave excellent trouble free service to Carneys.

Alan Coulson

12/05/15

South Cerney to Cirencester

I am looking for some background info and photo’s regarding a Bus service run by Mr Short & Mr W Huxley (& later Mr Cecil Huxley) who run a bus service from South Cerney to Cirencester around the early 1920’s.
In the 1925/6 Bristol buses route No. 57 took on the route between Cirencester & Gloucester.

Peter R

31/03/15

Charabanc Pictures

I am currently working on a follow-up book to my Richards Bros one. I have several 1920s operators using charabancs. Two in particular are:-
1. Maxwell 20-seat charabanc, and 2. Victory Charabanc.
Can anyone supply a generic picture of a twenty-seat Maxwell (I see plenty of 13-seaters), and can anyone tell me if the Victory was a make of charabanc, or just a name chosen by individual operators. The latter is very likely, given that the Great War had recently ended. If it was a make of charabanc or indeed a lorry I would also like to locate a generic picture for this as well.

Les Dickinson

01/02/15

Small Operator in Durham

I am looking for any information about a small bus/coach company in Durham during the 40s/60s, the owner was a Thomas Fox and I’m not sure if FOX’S was the name used. I do know they ran mostly around the Spennymoor – Ferryhill sort of area in County Durham.

Billie Reaveley

07/10/14

Bridlington Independents

Some years ago I came across a ticket for Yellow Cars in respect of a 3d journey from Flamborough Village to North Landing. Can anyone throw any light on this firm?

Chris Plewes

04/10/14

Southport Livery

Does anyone know the original colours of the Southport livery. I know that they are red & cream, but I need to identify the names.

Dave Rimmer

09/09/14

Thames/Duple Yeoman PKS 95

Can anyone please help? I’m looking for photos of Thames Trader/Duple Yeoman registration PKS 95, operated in the 1960s by Austin’s of Earlston, Scotland but new in 1963 to Hardie of Melrose.
I’ve done my usual search of Google sources with no success, so hoping someone may have something tucked away in a slide/photo collection.

Paul Savage

20/08/14

Old Coaching Film

On You Tube there is a 9½ minute travel promotional film entitled ‘Travel by coach – go North Western’ which features glimpses of a number of different B.E.T. Group coaches including North Western, Ribble, Midland Red, East Kent, Hebble, Black & White etc.
Whose coach is crossing the Pennines at 3:34? Trent? Willowbrook bodywork?
There are interior shots of a well appointed 2+1 seated luxury coach from 4:41. A Southdown Leyland Royal Tiger touring coach?
After the first couple of minutes of non PSV introduction there is a quaint intro showing a Southdown booking clerk.
The video shows short highlights from the film ‘Wheels over Britain’ produced by ‘Coaching Journal’ and the full version can be bought from Manchester’s Museum of Transport.
Here is the link to –

David Slater

14/08/14

St. Helens Livery

I live on a narrowboat and next year is "paint up" year! I’ve fallen in love with the St. Helens livery and wonder if any of your knowledgeable people have any idea of the BS numbers for the cream and red paints?
I wait in hope,

Chris Betteridge

21/07/14

Western Welsh Refinery Contract

In 1960 Western Welsh bought ten vehicles from South Wales Transport for use at Milford Haven on the Esso refinery construction contract. The vehicles were five AEC Regent II registration EWN 344/5/8/9/54 and five AEC Regal III FCY 342/7 and FWN 802/3/4. Does anyone know what colour these operated in at the refinery? Might they have been painted dark green? Alternatively does anyone know where they went later in 1960 on completion of the refinery?

Les Dickinson

23/06/14

Longwell Green Coaches

Can anyone define whether Longwell Green only produced (rebody or rebodied) coaches ie Bedford/Leyland in the late 1940’s (1948-1950) or were they classed as new coaches.

Alan Coulson

27/05/14

Buses to Hurworth/Darlington County Durham

Has anyone any information on this bus service, in the 1950s. Bedford buses were used and I think the owners were named Holland, two brothers.

M Howe

25/05/14

Tower Wagon CET 440

Too lazy to write my own question so this is a copy and paste from David Bradley Online – Bournemouth Picture Gallery at

"Tower Wagon CET 440. Originally owned by Rotherham Corporation, having been converted from a former single-deck bus, it was used by them until closure of their own trolleybus system in October 1965. During the 1970’s, CET440 was sold and its present where whereabouts are unknown. It was thought to have gone to a preservationist somewhere in the north-west. The DVLA website shows CET 440 as registered until 1 March 2006, but the present owner details are withheld."

Anyone know the answer please?

Peter Cook

11/01/14

East Midlands Buses 1930-1939

I’m looking for information on bus services and the buses they ran c1930-39. Particularly around the small mining villages on the Notts/Derbys border (i.e. Shirebrook, Creswell, Whitwell and links to Chesterfield and Mansfield).
Any help/pictures would be great.

Paul Wilkinson

03/01/14

National Plant/National Coal Board

Although many operators provided services for mineworkers the NCB had buses of their own. Does anyone know if any printed work, definitive or otherwise, exists on this subject? If one wished to produce such a book are there any recognised sources of base information of NCB buses other than Bus Lists on the Web, which details over eighty buses bought new. I am sure there will be many others, as well as those purchased second-hand from such as Crosville etc.

Les Dickinson

07/12/13

1968 Bedford VAL 70

Hi in order to get my Bedford Val registered here in Germany I need for the German documents the loudness in DBs of the engine. I cannot find it anywhere. Does anyone have this information in writing please?

Simon

03/11/13

Picture of Western Welsh PBO 685

Has anybody out there got a picture of Western Welsh AEC Bridgemaster PBO 685 in service with them. There are plenty of pictures of others of the batch, but 685 seems to have been remarkably camera shy. This is the bus I passed my PSV test on in 1972, with the Wallace School of Transport in Nottingham. I would like to add it to my website at so I would like permission to use it.

Stephen Howarth

15/10/13

C H & O H Omnibuses

Many years ago (1959 I think) I found on Gravesend Central railway station approach a brown paper bus ticket made by Bell Punch with C H & O H OMNIBUSES printed at the top. It was the size of one-and-a-half Ultimate ticket and had fare stages marked in old UK money values. I don’t have the ticket any longer but it’s been bothering me all these years. Has anybody any idea who the bus was and where they were based?

Ray Stringer

17/09/13

Photographs Required

I have written the story of Richards Bros, Moylgrove. They only ever had seven double-deckers but I have been unable to find photographs of some. Can anyone supply photos of ex Wigan (via Red & White) TD1 EK 8332 or ex Maidstone & District K6A HKL 846 & 856. Also need ex Ribble DRN 270 please.

Les Dickinson

13/07/13

Fales Coaches of Combe Down, Bath.

During my days at Secondary modern School I travelled to and from school daily on a Fales coach, usually a Bedford OWB with a Bath registration and no destination box which I suspect was an ex M.O.D. version. The wooden slatted seats had been replaced with leather ones similar to those on the upper deck of Birmingham City Transport Daimler COG5’s. Fales had a mixed fleet at the time including OB’s, a Commer, an AEC and I think a Seddon or Vulcan or both. Has anyone history, details and/or photos of Fales coaches in the mid 1950’s please?

Mike Holloway

18/06/13

Karrier buses supplied to the LNER

Any information or photos of this subject would be of great interest.

Richard Meayers

29/04/13

Maudslay Marathon & Tilling Stevens chassis lists

Does anyone have chassis lists for Maudslay Marathon 11/111 & Tilling Stevens K6MA7 K5/6LA7 & L4MA8 / L6PA7 that they could supply me with.

Geoff Clayton

27/02/13

Strachan’s Deeside Fodens

Has anyone got any information about Strachan’s Deeside Omnibus Service based in Ballater?

Alex Morrison

14/01/13

Enterprise AEC Regent 111s

Does anyone else remember the AEC Gazette recording the order from Enterprise of Scunthorpe for several Regents with Charles Roberts bodies around 1948. ie before talk of the takeover by Lincs Road Car?
None arrived but they did take delivery of Regals around this time.

Steve Milner

07/12/12

Bristol single deck buses – Ambulance conversions

In 1939/40 Western National converted a number of these to Civil Defence ambulances (the conversion was based I believe on a Home Office general spec). Does anyone have or know of photos of these conversions in service or documents relating to them. (I have the Tilling Group booklet "The War that went on Wheels" and thus have the "parade" photo taken prior to service).

David Walmsley

25/11/12

Wigan Corp EK 8332

Does anyone have a picture of EK 8332 please. It was an all Leyland lowbridge decker of 1931 which went to Richards, Moylgrove in the early forties and was their first d/d.

Les Dickinson

12/11/12

Bedford SBG Mulliner PGK 862

Can anyone tell me the history of this London registered, Mulliner bodied Bedford SBG please.

Les Dickinson

11/11/12

Queen street bus depot

I’m just wondering if you can help me, I was born in Walton St, Team in Gateshead there was a bus depot at the top of my street in the 60s,(Queen street bus depot) I’m just wondering if anyone has any info or photos on it please.

Lynda Garrett

07/11/12

Brackley Central

I am building a layout of Brackley Central Northamptonshire in 1962 and I am trying to find some photos of bus types and liveries for that period. Any help would be appreciated.

Graham Hartley

07/10/12

Wall’s Coaches

I wonder if anyone can help me? I’m trying to trace a photo of a coach from a firm called Wall’s Coaches who were based at Kingsey on the Oxon/Bucks border. Would you possibly have one please, or maybe can put me in touch with someone who would have? They used to run trips to the coast and were also used for ferrying local workers to their factories. I would love a photo of any make of coach, as long as it was a Wall’s coach. It is for an article I am writing for a local magazine.

Mike Payne

14/08/12

PSV Badges

There is mention of the Southern Traffic Area – reference letter ‘J’
This area was disbanded before 1935 when the round ‘Metrovick Traffolyte’ badges with double identity letters were introduced. Therefore ‘JJ’ badges were never issued.
The badges used were the earlier enamel type with single letter. Therefore ‘J’ would be the identity letter. I have a website at if anybody has a ‘J’ badge which I could illustrate on it please contact me through the ‘Contact Me’ page on the site.
There is an example out there I do know, but not who has it.

Stephen Howarth

18/06/12

F H Dean

My local company was F H Dean Old Church St Garage, Newton Heath Fred Harold Dean ran a fleet of immaculate green and cream coaches including Crossleys Fred Dean lived opposite me (I was a young lad and asked for a photo of the company vehicles) but to no avail! Arthur Mayne bought out the Deans approx 1961 but continued the Dean name into the 60s. I have had a interest in Maynes for many years does any one out there know of any F H Dean photos? to date I have not found one.

Mark Mc Alister

26/05/12

Mansfield District PNN 774

Does anyone know if a photo of Mansfield District PNN 774 exists with either Ives or Kingfisher please?

Stephen Didymus

10/05/12

Thames Valley buses in Windsor

I am looking for the above views by R. F. Mack or other sources for use on my website, The Royal Windsor Website.com. Routes are normally 51 or 20. This is my own site, paid for by myself and non-commercial, so am enquiring about availability and any fees that might be required for reproduction.

Roger Cullingham

28/04/12

Sharpes of Beighton

I am collecting information about my school service provider – Sharpes of Beighton – in the hope of writing an article for inclusion in a future edition of Buses Yearbook. Problem is that I have no photographs at all of this defunct operator. My school years were from 1958-1965 but I would welcome information and especially photographs from any time in their history. To the best of my knowledge there is no documented account of this operator to be found. I would like to put that right. Can you help?

Les Dickinson

16/02/12

Sheffield Corporation TD5 – No.3

I am researching certain aspects of public transport between Totley, Sheffield and Dronfield, Derbyshire in the era 1951/5.
As a school boy I travelled to Dronfield daily, the preferred bus/train was the 0803 from Totley Cross Scythes to Dore & Totley station to connect into the 0817 semi fast train to Gloucester, which called at Dronfield, specially for the Dronfield Grammar School pupils. For quite some time the 0803 was serviced with a rather ancient Leyland TD5 NO. 3 (complete with rear hook for attachment of a gas trailer). Leylands of any description were a rareity in Totley at this time, mostly AEC’s from Bramhall Lane and occasionally utility Daimlers from Leadmill Road. I believe the bus and crew were from Townhead Street and the TD5 worked this as a fillin turn. This bus was always known as number 3 the conductor was pretty regular and we schoolboy enthusiasts had it as firm favourite. Can anyone explain why we had a bus and crew from Townhead Street

Jerry Wilkes

27/12/11

Ribble Leyland Cheetah

I checked your site to see if you had a photo of the Brush-bodied Leyland Cheetah coaches bought by Ribble in 1936. The Ribble Vehicle Preservation Trust has no.1568 which is about to begin restoration at Cobus. We need to source some interior shots to help with the restoration but it’s difficult to find any. Could we include a request on your site in the hope someone, somewhere has such a photo. All advice appreciated.

Ray Bignell

18/11/11

Bristol Lodekka prototype

The first Bristol Lodekka prototype – LDX001 – was built in 1949 and entered service with Bristol T&CC as their C5000 (LHY 949). It had a transmission layout whereby a propshaft ran from the back of the gearbox along to a differential unit mounted roughly halfway along the offside of the chassis. The drive was then split, with a further propshaft continuing the drive to an offside worm-drive unit and the rear wheel. Drive to the nearside went across the chassis from the differential via a short cross-shaft with a set of bevel gears at each end. The drive then continued to the nearside rear wheel via a propshaft and worm-drive unit mirroring that of the offside. A second Prototype – LDX002 – was built in 1950 for West Yorkshire Road Car as its 822 (JWT 812). It is known that 822 had a different transmission layout, with the differential unit mounted on the rear of the gearbox, and the drive taken to the rear worm-drive units by two full-length propshafts – one either side of the chassis.Does anyone know if this was a modification to LDX002’s original layout, as it appears to be something of a grey area? The vehicle toured quite a few BTC operators before eventually entering service with West Yorkshire for six months in 1951. It then returned to the chassis manufacturer for two months before being exhibited at the Festival of Britain – resuming service with West Yorkshire in October 1951. Could the return to Bristol have been for the fitting of the modified transmission? (A patent for this was applied for by Bristol in December 1950). Alan Townsin’s excellent book ‘The Bristol Story’ shows a drawing of the original prototype chassis with the mid-mounted differential layout and states this is "as first used on the 1949 and 1950 prototypes". Two other books claim the West Yorkshire bus had the gearbox-mounted differential layout from new. Any information would be greatly appreciated.

Brendan Smith

17/11/11

Gray Brothers

Could you help? I am looking for a photo of a Grays (Gray Brothers) now known as Grayways of Wigan coach – an early 1950s AEC. We think it is possible one of these may still exist in some condition – possibly part of a large batch and maybe in Hargreaves of Bolton livery who it is possible was owned by Gras for a period.

Tim Presley

29/10/11

Black & White

Do any of your members have any photo’s of Black & White vehicles. I am looking for one of PAD 160 for my comprehensive collection and also all of the ex City of Oxford coaches that were sent to B&W Reg’s started EDF

Trevor Walton

25/09/11

Chieftain buses

Does anyone know of any site that has anything on J. Laurie and Sons Chieftain buses of Hamilton in the 1940s?
Grateful for any info.

Jim Hepburn

12/09/11

Timperley Coaches

Can anyone please supply more details of the Timperley Coaches operation – such as dates of operation, who owned it, and what vehicles did they prefer. Is there any connection with Timperley Coach Subsidiaries Ltd., Manchester? Thank you.

Roger Watts



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